How to lead with transparency amidst adversity — Don Faul, CEO of CrossFit and former Google, Facebook & Pinterest exec

 Well, Don, thanks so much for joining us.

 So we got reconnected because I was emailing with Molly Graham, who's a mutual friend of ours, and I was asking her who are interesting people that maybe people haven't heard of. Um, and when she introduced us and sort of mentioned your name, she said Don is the best manager in the valley, which I, I think coming from her couldn't be higher praise because she's quite picky about terms like that.

And, and so I'm curious if you sort of had to guess why she would say that, or maybe what did you figure out or what do you do in kind of this big of category of management? what do you think it is?

 Oh gosh. Well, uh, that's a lot to live up to. So, uh, that sets the, sets the bar pretty high, especially coming from Molly. Well, I guess first thing I'd say is I, uh, there's nothing that I've completely figured out. Um, , you know, if I've, if I've learned anything, especially in the realm of, of managing and leading people is, uh, there's always more to learn.

You know, I think I had the benefit at a pretty young age to kind of get thrown into management and leadership. You know, I started my career in the military. Uh, so at age 21, when I graduated from the Naval Academy, my first job I was, you know, put in charge of, uh, 40 Marines. Um, which is insane. I had no idea what I was doing.

But, uh, you know, straight into the fire, as they say. And I think so much of leadership, um, like a lot of other things is, is just learning through experience and learning through opportunity and. While I've had a little bit of a crazy all over the place career, you know, from the Marine Corps to technology to now CrossFit, you know, the one consistent theme throughout my career has been leadership.

You know, having the opportunity to be a part of and, and, uh, and lead teams at, in a variety of different contexts. And so I think I've been really lucky to have some incredible mentors, some incredible experiences, um, you know, over the course of the past couple decades. And, and it's been something that I think if I really think about what really drives me and where I draw my fulfillment, um, when it comes to work, it's all about people.

 So when you use the term leadership, what, what's sort of the non cliche language you use to communicate what it actually means?

 I think leadership is about, Enabling people to achieve their very best individually and collectively. And I think I stole that from John Wooden, so maybe that doesn't count. But, that's what I, you know, I, I really buy into the, the servant leadership philosophy or construct that, you know, leadership is a privilege and it's a privilege that allows you to have an impact on people's lives and help them, achieve great things.

Again, whether that's a, as an individual or, or more importantly and probably more relevant, uh, as, as a group or organization.

 And what's the, how behind that, right. In the sense of like if somebody were to watch the way that you manage or lead, right, which I assume is in service of enabling people individually and collectively to achieve,

how are you actually doing it? Or maybe said differently. I assume you have lots of young managers in your career that you've helped develop and you are, you are giving them frameworks and explaining what they need to do to sort of achieve excellent leadership.

And so what are the things you're teaching them?

 Yeah. So there's, you know, a few things that, uh, that I try to teach them that I've learned over the years. I think, you know, it really starts with, I think a, a leader's job is providing clarity and context for their people. So if you're fortunate, you know, you've got a, a collection, uh, a group of amazing people who are highly motivated, um, uh, who hold themselves to a high bar.

I think a big part of a leader's job is helping them understand what success looks like. And so that comes down to, you know, what is, is your vision for the organization? What is the strategy? Um, how do you help people understand what success looks like and individually and collectively so, You know, when I talk to leaders, the, the first thing I really start with is, you know, number one is making sure that your people have clarity.

Um, the second, you know, along with that construct, uh, you know, that, that helps them understand what success looks like, is making sure that you have the information on an ongoing basis to do their job well. Um, uh, I like to, you know, general, uh, Stan McChrystal had this term he uses, um, uh, that he calls creating a shared consciousness within an organization.

And I love it. I, I love that term cause I think it captures it really well. So it's about helping your team first understand what success looks like, and then make sure they have the information on an ongoing basis to make great decisions and do their job and operate with. Third, it's, it's helping coach and, and, uh, mentor people, um, through their journey.

So using, uh, your moments like one-on-ones or using times in meetings, interactions to help coach people through some of the challenges that they're going through, help them develop a set of skills that they can use as they grow their impact on their career. Um, and in part, you know, with that, I think comes another important responsibility, which is helping them navigate in and around obstacles when they, and that could be helping them partner with different parts of the organization.

 On the first one, the point around clarity and context. Um, why do you think that's so hard? Because cause I, I certainly agree and I think at the same time, if you look at the average team lead, this is the area that is at, that they actually struggle with or, or it doesn't occur to them as like a P zero thing relative to things like, uh, coaching and mentoring and things like that.

 You know, I think the, you know, you touched on, on that, that new team leader, I think that's actually the hardest transition. Um, you know, for a lot of folks, they go through a transition of being an individual contributor. And often the folks who are elevated to leadership first are the folks who are strongest as the individual contributors.

And I think a lot of the habits that, that can make you an exceptional individual contributor, uh, can get your way as a leader. So, you know, uh, a desire to make sure all of your work is perfect and manage the detail and, um, make sure that, uh, things are executed really well. That can translate to, as a young leader, Micromanaging, getting in the details, having a hard time delegating and letting go.

Um, having a hard time giving your team and your people the space, um, to make decisions. Uh, and setting them up for success is no longer about doing yourself. It's about helping articulate again, what success looks like and then coaching people along the way. And so I think that that's something, you know, for new managers, getting comfortable with delegating, which explicitly means getting comfortable with, uh, enabling people on your team to make decisions and make mistakes can be really, really hard for folks who hold themselves to such a high bar and high standard.

 On the point about micromanagement, do you think it's always a bad thing?

 I think micromanagement is a bad thing. Uh, I think being close to the details at times is actually important. And I think they're two separate things. Um,

 think one of the re. Yeah, for sure. So I, I think one of the really important, um, uh, things that I think a leader needs to be able to do that, that gets increasingly difficult, I think as you get more senior, is staying close enough to the business, staying, staying close enough to your problems so that you understand what's going on, is that you can help your team with useful coaching feedback, um, or understand how you can lead more effectively, whether that's providing additional clarity or context.

Um, and, and I think being in the details, sometimes asking hard questions, pushing on things, sometimes doing the work alongside your team is necessary in service of that. Um, micromanagement, I think is really when you step into, when, when you are in the details in service of making decisions on behalf of your team.

Um, and so I think you can be close to the details in service of, of your understanding and your context without getting, uh, in between your team and their ability to make decisions. Take risks. . There's definitely a lot of nuance there. Um, I think also a really big important part of it is having a really open conversation with your team, um, about why you're in the details and what it's in service of, and opening and, and inviting a dialogue, uh, that articulates, Hey, look, my goal here is not, uh, to make you feel like I don't trust you, Michael, here is not to be in all of your decisions.

And if you ever feel that way, I want you to let me know so I can course correct.

 That it sort of builds on what I was gonna ask, which is how do you, well, I guess there's kind of multiple parts, but how do you know if you're close enough to the details or problems? Like is there a self diagnostic that sort of makes sure that you're flying at the right altitude and. What are you doing to create the conditions that your team is comfortable saying, no, I actually think you are micromanaging me, and it's, and it's creating an environment that's not productive for me.

 So I, I think you, you know, as a leader, one of the things you have to work really hard on is creating an environment where your people, the people around you feel comfortable being honest with you and that this sounds like really obvious, but it's really challenging actually. And as you get more, more senior, obviously it gets more and more difficult, uh, to create that environment.

And, um, I think being able to do that well, I think you do that by, by spending time with people. I think you do that by being open when you make mistakes. I think you do that by asking open-ended questions of people, um, to solicit feedback on decisions you're making or statements you're making. Uh, I think you do it by rewarding people and recognizing people who push and challenge you and, and sharing with the group how people challenging you helped you make better decisions.

I think these little things in your behaviors are really important in creating an environment again, where people feel comfortable pushing on you. If you're able to achieve that, um, that is the, the most valuable and impactful thing that you can do, because you will then have a group of people around you who feel a responsibility, uh, to let you know if you're getting too far in the details or, uh, pursuing a path that may not be the right one for the company.

 one of the things that I, that I try to do is build into my schedule, um, one-on-one time with not only my direct reports, which is kind of a normal course, but also trying to do skip level meetings, or when I travel, I, I take the time to grab people and just talk to them in an informal setting, one-on-one, and have a conversation.

 And in that conversation there'll be questions, and those questions will help me understand, uh, and feel out. A number of things from, Hey, how good a job are we doing, communicating our vision and what success looks like. Can these folks kind of play that back for me? But also asking questions to, to help me assess how close I am to understanding the business is my perception of where we are really grounded in reality.

For the folks on my team, were actually doing work. And I find those conversations, the informal ones to be incredibly valuable.

 Can you share more on the skip level? And you mentioned one of the questions, but like what, um, are there a handful of questions that you find gives you the most signal?

 So a, there's a, there's a couple questions that I think if, if I think about our job, it really traces back to, I kind of come back to our responsibility as a leadership team. So if we start again with, uh, it really important part of our job is creating strategic clarity. You know, what are we trying to achieve as an organization?

Ultimately, I wanna make sure if we're doing our job well as a leadership, Every single member of the team can trace that, uh, success as an organization down to their individual role. So I'll ask, Hey, you know, help me understand, um, how your work connects to the company strategy. What are you working on right now?

How does that ladder up and connect what we're trying to achieve as a company? Um, hey, do you, you know, what's your sense for the top priorities for the company right now? Those are really, really clarifying. Um, and, and, you know, really helping assess and understand how good a job we're doing communicating.

I'll always ask, Hey, you know, what are a few things that, that you feel like we're doing as a company right now, um, that we should double down on that you think we're doing a really good job of? And then what are two or three things that you think we can do that I can do as a leader, that we can do as a leadership team to, uh, to set the, the company up to be even more successful?

Um, and those are the types of questions that often you get, uh, really open, kind of candid feedback around.

 So this sort of builds on that first point when you were laying out the how behind leading, which is around providing clarity and context. And I'd be interested, what are the rituals or practices or systems that you think make up sort of the operating system or set of behaviors that someone can follow to increase the chances that they provide appropriate clarity and context for their people?

 Yeah, so the first I'd say is, um, really starts with, for, for any organization, their overall approach to planning and, and you know, there's no one size fits all. Obviously. It's really dependent on, on the organization and the size and the stage and what they're focused on. But, um, taking the time to get the team together to be really thoughtful about what, what the overall plan and strategy is starting at.

Ideally, you're starting with a longer term orientation. Hey, What is the vision for the organization? How does that come back then to a X year strategy for the organization That comes back to, hey, what do we want to achieve this year over the course of the next six months? And so, you know, as you obviously are getting closer to the near term, you're increasing your level of clarity and specificity and resolution.

And this could manifest in, again, there's a bunch of different tools. You know, we happen to use, uh, an OKR format. So we've got a set of OKRs then, uh, objectives and key results for the organization, uh, and company that then ultimately filtered down to each individual on the team. So I think that planning cadence is, you know, in figuring out how to do the right mix of tops down and bottoms up, you know, so I think at a senior level, having some degree of, of high level vision and intent is really helpful for the team.

And then given the organization the time to get their team involved in planning. And ultimately resulting in, uh, a set of OKRs for the organization. And, you know, you can figure out what the right cadence is. We do it twice a year. Um, some organizations do it, uh, on a quarterly basis. So I'd say that's really essential, kind of number one.

The second piece is figuring out what I would articulate are the right call 'em operational rhythms, the right series of meetings and conversations that set the organization up to, uh, monitor progress against that strategy, but more importantly, update and inform that strategy as you're learning. So, you know, the roadmap that you bring into any pays is really a best guess.

It's a hypothesis based on kind of what you've learned before and what you believe to be true. And I think really good organizations. Retain a degree of flexibility. And they've got meetings and operating rhythms that allow you to revisit assumptions, allow you to evaluate the things you're working on so that that strategy can be one that kind of lives and breathes as you learn more.

And so figuring out, again, there's no right size fits all, figuring out, hey, what are the meetings that we can have where we can check in on progress? Where it's really about a dialogue of what we've learned and how we're applying those learnings moving forward and creating a culture of accountability and really high quality work.

And then the last piece I'd say is the more informal side of making sure that, um, within the organizations, your managers are spending time with their people. They're having productive one-on-ones. They're talking about challenges. They've got the opportunity, um, to have coaching conversations Last thing I'd say is as part of the overall operating rhythms, I think it's important and, and again, this is all right size based on the size and stage of the organization to get the entire team together periodically. Um, and again, this is an opportunity to share information in service of that shared consciousness.

So again, it's, we do it about once a month, we get our team together, revisit the strategy, revisit what we've learned, talk about what's next in the hopper, get a chance to recognize some of the great work that's happening and kind of broadcast that to the team.

 That's sort of a, a great explainer. I think. I'm interested, when you talk about operating rhythms, maybe, what does that look like or what did you institute in your, your current role on sort of a weekly or monthly basis?

 So the first thing we did actually was, and I would encourage, you know, any organization who's thinking about this, the first thing we did was just assess what we had been doing. And what was working and what wasn't. Uh, again, I think one of the things that's, uh, I think d dangerous and really common is you attempt to bring a model or structural from another organization and try to impose it on a new end.

And again, there's no model here that's cookie cutter and works best. So the first thing we did, the first thing I did at CrossFit when I joined the team was, um, had a chance to observe and talk to the team about what we had. So how are we sharing information? How are we planning, how are we making you ensuring that our team is getting the information they need to get decisions?

And then we assessed, so we did that through some informal conversations. So as I was getting up to speed meeting with people, asking questions about what was working well and what could be improved, we also looked at some data that we had, um, from internal surveys, so engagement surveys. Uh, and one of the top things that we, we heard from our team in that was that, uh, they wanted more clarity, um, uh, in, in what the company was working towards and about how their work connected to it.

So we saw that, um, there was a real opportunity here to improve that for the team. And then as a leadership team, we had a conversation about, um, again, what are the current rhythms are, are are elements of those working that we can preserve? And then we introduced a few different ideas. So I shared a little bit from my experience, we heard from other people on the team.

And then what we did was we outlined a plan, um, for the next six month period and really framed it as an experiment. So, um, understanding that, the way we work and these rhythms, the optimal ones are ones that, uh, are gonna evolve as an organization. We're gonna try out a series of things. We're gonna look at X, Y, and Z to evaluate whether or not they're working.

We'll double down on the things that are working well and then we'll change and evolve the things that won't, and we're gonna do that now. So every six months when we do a restart our planning process, we look not only at our overall strategy, but we also look at the way we work to make sure that we can kind of continue to involve and build on that.

 And so if you look at the experiment that you've been running for the last six months, uh, how would you explain kind of the different parts of it or the different meetings or reporting structures or that type of stuff?

 Sure. So there's a number of things. The first thing that we worked on was, um, we actually didn't have a really clearly articulated long-term vision for the company that, that people are excited about, that we could share internally and then externally, uh, outside the company with our community as well.

And so we outlined, we really started with that. So that was a mix of conversations with our leadership team and then folks from across the company informed by conversations we had had with partners outside the company as well we had a nice round number and said, Hey, we're gonna articulate a 2030 vision for CrossFit.

What does that look like? from there we built out, um, a strategy to get us there. So we said, okay, if we understand what success looks like now, we're generally aligned around that and excited about it. How do we get. And that was a much more, more of a blocking and tackling exercise where we looked at the necessary strategic phases.

We broke down how we would evaluate success. Uh, and we built out kind of a seven year, three phase plan to get there that had high level milestones and success metrics that we believed, um, would help us understand if we were on the right path from there. That helped us get to a 2023. So we were doing this work in the fall.

We wanted to enter this year with a strategy I set of goals for the year that laddered up into that 2030 vision and seven year strategy. And so, uh, we built out as a leadership team, uh, a strategy for the year for 2023, and then separated it into kind of first half and second half. And ultimately, um, we were able to take all of that work, um, to the team and communicate it.

We also communicated that vision and strategy externally to our community as well. Next thing we worked on then was, okay, now that we've got a set of, again, in our case, OKRs, that we're gonna use, that we understand how they map to our strategy. We understand how they help reinforce our vision. Now how do we ensure that we're making progress against those OKRs and learning and course correcting along the way?

So we have what we call operating reviews. We do them for the major parts of our business. Um, we have somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 or 12 folks. So the, the, the team. So we'll do one for our product team, we'll do one for our, part of our team supports our, our gyms or affiliate owners around the world.

Uh, and every month we'll do an operating review. And that's an update on the progress that we're making against R OKRs. It's an assessment of things that we've launched and what we've learned from them, and then it is an articulation of the next series. That's are experiments that we're gonna run in service of hitting those goals.

And it's meant to drive accountability. There's dialogue, it's intentionally really cross-functional. So one of the things that we had identified was that we were operating in a really siloed capacity. Uh, we weren't doing a great job of communicating and coordinating across the business. And so these operating reviews are cross-functional by design.

And, um, they give us an opportunity to both broadcast and discuss the kind of key strategic issues in each respective domain. So those operating reviews are a really important part of driving accountability and driving awareness, uh, across the company. We record those and take notes, and we distribute them to the entire company.

So if you are in the review, again, we try to keep the group small so that we can have dialogue and discussion, but we then record and distribute it so anyone in the company can view any operating review and get the information and context that they need. We also have, uh, all hands once a month. And so in our all hands we'll get the team together.

We do it, uh, through Zoom, and that is a condensed version of our operating reviews. So it's about an hour long, about 40 minutes of, uh, produced work where we articulate progress against our goals. And then we also include kind of a deep dive on some of the major things that we've launched or shipped, uh, in, effort of, of recognizing folks who have done great work and make sure the team understands the, the awesome work that's happening across the organization.

So, um, we've been working on those. And then the last thing I'll add is we just launched a really lightweights, um, uh, newsletter for the organization where we aggregate a bunch of the work that's happening across the organization. We post it internally to a wiki, and then we push it out in an email that happens once a month.

And that's a more detailed version of all the work that's happening across the organization.

 There's so much to jump into from that. I, I guess sort of at the top, you mentioned the 2030 vision for CrossFit. So I, I'm curious what it is, and I assume if you landed on it, you like it and what, what about it do you like? Um, I often find that sort of long-term visions can get very squishy and fluffy.

Um, but I'm curious kind of what you landed on and, and why you think it's effective.

 Yeah, I agree. I long-term visions can be really hard. Uh, for, for, I think the reasons you articulate. I think for us, we wanted to, in our vision, and the reason that we like it and we've gotten so far, knock on wood, some pretty good feedback from our community, is I think it really articulates in our vision what we care about, uh, what our principles are and where we're gonna take really, uh, strong stances.

Um, and so, you know, we have the benefit with CrossFit of playing a role within a really rich ecosystem. So, you know, we, we talk about our company CrossFit as CrossFit hq, and then we have all of our gym owners. So we have almost 14,000 gym owners around the world. They're an essential part of our community.

Yeah, it's amazing. Amazing. We've got millions of people who do CrossFit. We have, uh, partners who are integral in the, in, in, uh, the ecosystem. Folks like Noble at a large apparel and shoe brands. We have Rogue, which makes fitness equipment, lots of other folks. And then we have our coaches. We have over a hundred thousand, uh, CrossFit coaches who are training people, changing lives in those 14,000 gyms around the world. I really view our role, our role is to play a leadership role in that community and ecosystem. And so that vision is not just the work we're gonna do. That vision is hopefully collectively what's possible if the whole community works together. And I think it's particularly essential that, that we play a role in shaping and articulating that.

And so, to give you an example, one of the things that we wanted to make really, really clear was that our true north, the thing we are most focused on is reaching more people and exposing more people to CrossFit. So it wasn't a revenue goal, it wasn't an earnings goal, it wasn't a number of gym's goal, it was more lives transformed by CrossFit.

Now, by the way, if we do that, all of those other things end up being really positive as well. It's the, it's the kinda rising tide that lifts all boats. But we wanted to articulate that as the North Star. That is why we are in this. And I think that's important because I think for, you know, we talk about what really inspires and motivates people.

It's those types of intrinsic, um, people can get excited about impacting that many lives in a way that is, I think, much more fundamentally powerful than getting excited about some random revenue number eight years in the future. So I think that ended up being really powerful and it said to our community, made a really strong stance about what we care about.

And that's been a little under the question we took on. Um, we raised some money here. The company was purchased about two years ago and shifted from being a private organization, private company, to one now that is private equity owned. And on the back of that acquisition, a lot of folks in the community were asking, what does this change about the future?

What does this change about what CrossFit stands for? And so this vision for us was meant to be a really bold statement about what that true North is. And, and I think it's one that that brings a lot of people. In that, you know, we talked about a few other things. We talked about, um, uh, the role, uh, that we believe affiliate owners play, that coaches play, that partners play.

I think that was important. I think it sends a really important and powerful message that, that we view our role as one, as, as, as a leadership. One that's about bringing people together, that we view this future vision as what's possible with a really strong partnership. And, uh, I, I think that tone is a really important one in our ecosystem.

So I think those are some of the things that we tried. We wanted to make sure we articulated really, really clearly. Uh, and then we set a number in terms of our growth that was really aggressive, um, achievable, but really aggressive. And I think people get really excited about that.

 So, zooming in a little bit, you talked about the, the importance of operating reviews, at least in the context of the way that you'd like to, to sort of run, run a business. Um, I'm interested if a CEO came to you and said, you know, we want to implement operating reviews, or We kind of do something like this, but I'm just not happy with it.

 Could you go a few clicks deeper and sort of explain some tips and tricks to make those really, really high quality and useful?

 Sure. So I'll, I'll, I'll tell you what we have tried, um, and what we've, what we've leaned into. I think the first is, I think that the most transactional but important part of the operating view that we start with is just progress against your goals. And I actually think there's an element of knowing that on a monthly, biweekly, whatever cadence you decide that you have to stand and communicate the progress that you've made is really, really important.

It drives a level of focus and urgency. We don't even spend a lot of time going into the details. You just have to update it. So we update. Here are the OKRs, here's where we're trending. There's an expectation that if it's yellow or red, there is a plan attached to getting it, you know, specifically articulating how it gets to green.

Uh, we don't even spend time covering the greens, so if we have reds or yellows, we'll spend time on it. If not, we kind of move on. Um, so I, I, I would say having a, first I would ask , do you have a clear set of goals? Does every team have a clear set of goals? And that seems obvious, but there's a lot of places that don't necessarily.

So that's a really good starting point. Um, next I'd say, you know, after covering off on progress against goals or OKRs, I think the most important piece is really reinforcing and building a culture of iteration and learning. Um, you know, I'm a big believer in, um, if, if you can create a culture where people are really good at taking thoughtful bets.

Good experiments that, that ensure, um, you're gonna learn and good experiments in service and are aligned with your goals, then you're gonna make great progress. So if you can build up high velocity of learning, it's one of the most important, I think, cultural, uh, foundations for successful companies. Um, and that sounds, again, very easy and very obvious, but actually creating a culture that's possible is really hard.

Running good experiments is a lot easier said than done. And so I really try to focus on, and I, I think beyond how to design and run good experiments, I think sometimes people get too fixated on the outcome of experiments and not fixated enough on the design of the experiments upfront. Um, you know, if you're doing things well, you should try a lot of stuff that fundamentally doesn't.

But if it had a strong hypothesis, grounded in what you understand about the business, aligned with where you're trying to go, it's a good experiment. And so designing an operating review that is specifically focused on, on what you've learned in the prior period. What are the bets that we ran? What was the hypothesis around those bets?

What did we learn by virtue of it? And then how are we using those learnings to inform the next set of bets and hypotheses? And I think if you can create that type of culture where people are able to design really good experiments and iterate really rapidly over time, the results will take care of themselves.

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Before taking over the helm of CrossFit as its new CEO, Don Faul’s leadership experience included an 8-year stint as a U.S. Marine Corps platoon commander and executive roles at Pinterest, Meta and Google. Here, he unpacks the leadership principles that have carried him through vastly different operating environments. 

How to lead with transparency amidst adversity — Don Faul, CEO of CrossFit and former Google, Facebook & Pinterest exec

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